XOR Userforum

Just trying to understand this NRPN bizness for the first time...  I’m trying to choose banks on my Novation Summit (and other NRPN MIDI messages to the Summit) from the Nerdseq.  I don’t understand how the “NRP1...4” works, after I read through the manual.

From what Novation tells me, bank changes are like NRPN, but a bit different.  The Summit apparently responds to bank changes on LSB (CC32) and a PC message.  So, I suppose I just send two simultaneous messages - a PC message (to choose my preset) and a value from 1-4 on CC32 (to choose the bank)?  It would be great to be able to send a PC on an overrule channel.  But seems NRPN wouldn’t be applicable here, am I right? 

But how about, for NRPN examples sake (as it’s what Novation used in my discussion with them), say, choosing “Patch Genre” which is set with Control Number 0:1 and a range of 0-9.  If I want to send, for instance:

MSB CC99 = 0
LSB CC98 = 1
MSB CC6 = 0
LSB CC38 = 7

I believe the top two choose the NRPN parameter number and the bottom two, the parameter value.  How would I do this with the NRPN FX, or is it simpler just to send the separate CC values?  Is the 0 to 3FFF just the full range - 128 x 128.  Actually, seems like that’s exactly what it is.   So I just send 0007 for the above example?  

Parenthetically, could this range of values up to 16,384 be used to increase the resolution of other NERDSEQ elements, modulation, etc, or would the processing strain be the rate-limiting factor?

For NRPN messages, it seems I have to set up something in the MIDI setup screen, but I don’t understand as I haven’t really messed around with NRPN before!  Do I just need to designate CC99 and CC98, to indicate these are used for choosing NRPN parameter numbers?  But where do I indicate these values then, for instance MSB CC99 = 0 and LSB CC98 = 1?

Thanks!

See NRPN Messages just as an expansion for the CC messages. Where CC can basically have only have 121 different CC with a max of 128 possible values, NRPN can have theoretically 16384 different parameters and values which allows a much finer resolution of like faders or so and many more parameters. The downside it that it needs much more bytes to send, for even only 1 message. (1 CC needs 3 bytes, one NRPN needs 12 bytes. (or 2 vs 8 if in running status mode)

With the NerdSEQ, since it is not possible to have that amount available within 1 column (16 bit max for the FX Value), the NRPN is splitted to multiple NRPN Parameter presets.
In the setup you choose which NRPN number you want to change. (that would be equivalent to the Messages MSB CC99/LSB CC98) and you only got to fill in the parameter number without taking care of LSB or MSB. In the FX of the sequence you choose then that you want to use NRPN1 (which has your selected parameter) and the value there is your wanted value..indeed in your case 0007 which equals to the value of 7. Also here you only need to know the value number and don't deal with LSB/MSB.

As for the Program change with bank change. You would need to indeed first set the CC messages to select a bank and after that send the Program change message. One thing here is that Program Change messages are being send out first before the FX CC messages and so you can only set the program change one row after the bank changes.
This was to allow a Program change with a direct parameter change after that. But this is also in the way for the Bank Select -> Program Change order. I am considering to flip that order.

For now, the NRPN message is only possible for the main midi channel of the track. If you need it for other channels like the overrule ones, then you got to build it yourself with the CC messages.

Perfect - thanks Thomas, it is clear to me now!